Talk:Isaac D'Israeli

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You're right, Isis ("I know I'm right," I hear you say), he did write a book on history - although his doctorate was in Civil Law. However, he is only now remembered for the snappy quotations from his collections of anecdotes, and I do feel that his interest in Commines was as a literary figure, not as a historian - which of course Commines was not. Deb

Your graciousness in posting this message is awesome. I've become interested in D'Israeli only within the past year, and just bought my copy of Curiosities this summer, and the fact that his son's glory has so overshadowed his accomplishments has me more than a little miffed (although I've long been a fan of his son, too). As the unsigned biography of him in that book points out, the reason Curiosities was so popular when it was written was: "It was the first revelation to the English people that they possessed materials for historical and critical investigations hardly inferior in value to the celebrated Memoirs of the French." I had not realized until I read the book that his so-called "anecdotes" were not fictional but actually mini-essays in history, footnoted and identifying the source documents D'Israeli consulted and, in many cases, refuting what other "historians" had said on the subject by identifying the documents that contradict their conclusions. (And, yes, his doctorate was in law, which honorary degrees usually are, but it was awarded to him for his biographical works on the Stuarts, on whom he was a recognized expert, not for his popular writings.) So when you refused to hear him called a "historian" while other authors (like Thomas B. Costain and Antonia Fraser) of both popular fiction and history are still called "historians" all the time, it did have me thinking unkind thoughts of you. So will you at least allow him to be called what one biographer said he was, a "literary historian," if you won't go for "author and historian"? -- isis 03:41 Oct 20, 2002 (UTC)

What IS interesting is that none of the British books I referred to contained any mention of him having written a book on history. It was only in an American book that I found the information - what does that tell us, I wonder? I'm aware that, by most people's definition, this makes him a "historian". It also makes Alison Weir one. It even makes me one, and I reject it as a description of myself. What I really want to know, though, is what D'Israeli's source was for the Commines story. -- Deb

Sorry for jumping in a couple years late, but Robert Blake's biography of Benjamin mentions Isaac's history of Charles I, and suggests that it was well-received at the time. Mackensen (talk) 13:31, 27 February 2006 (UTC)

All I have is Curiosities itself (which, by the way, I bought on eBay from someone in England), so I may be quoting what you already know: He says Commines's "violent enmity to the Duke of Burgundy" is clear from Commines's Memoirs; he doesn't specify the source documents for the boot-throwing: "has been traced by the minute researchers of anecdotes" is all he says in the article (but it may be referred to somewhere else in the book-- the fool thing has no organization at all, and the index is not very comprehensive), which I take to mean it is not a story Commines told on himself, although the bit about "wrote off his bile" about it in the Memoirs might mean he alluded to the incident. I'm guessing the source was the French "literature" D'Israeli immersed himself in when he went to Paris in 1786 to study the memoirs of all the old French writers, which seems to be what put him in mind to look at all the old English writings he could find, too.

Your not finding mention of his "serious" writings is just what I've been bitching about: His Portraiture of Judaism is said to have been a masterpiece of Jewish history and philosophy, and his book on Charles I was so good it got him the D.C.L. from Oxford, but even in his own time, all the public cared about was his Curiosities, which to him was just a collection of interesting historical facts he had picked up during years of reading. So if you start a fan club for him, please put me down as a charter member. -- isis 12:59 Oct 20, 2002 (UTC)

Money

It is often said that Isaac quarrelled with the Synagogue over money.

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